Melisse Gelula, columnist of The Feminism of Everyday Life, interviews triple creme, an all-queer, all-girl Brooklyn-based band about their novel position in the music world and their new CD.

How many queer, all-girl rock bands can you name? Use up all the fingers on your left hand yet? Didn’t think so. triple creme---comprised of four barely-thirty-somethings from Brooklyn, New York, with above-average looks and a mission to make smart rock happen---is one such combination. Hey, they’re two bands in one.

Of course, there are a few dyke bands out there, the most famous being the performative punk rockers, Tribe 8, who triple creme was lucky enough tofor last summer in New York and Toronto. But a quick tally invariably reveals that most gay bands are boys (Bronski Beat, Pet Shop Boys, Erasure, etc.). And the ladies, well, are soloists (Ani, KD, and Melissa Etheridge, etc.), whose music derives more from folk than fierceness.

When I interviewed triple creme in June, they’d just finished recording their second self-produced CD, Lucid, due for release this fall. I asked them, Is one dyke musician acceptable but four a confrontation?

Melisse: Please introduce yourselves and say what else you do, and if it’s related to what you do in the band.

Terry: Should we all talk at the same time?

Melisse: Yes, that’s best. No, wait. I’ll have you raise your hands, and I’ll call on you!

Christina: Okay, I’m Christina and I’m a painter and I play guitar and sing in the band. There’s definitely a relationship between the two. We can talk about that later though.

Melisse: You with the blue hair?

Robin: I play the guitar and I sing. And I’m writing a novel and I’m a yoga teacher and somehow all these things are connected. Um, yoga teachers are the rock stars of the new millennium?!

Tiffany: I’m the drummer. What do I do? I teach karate. And it’s clear these two things are all about aggression, aggression, aggression. Not really. They’re all outlets, though. And I’m a sound engineer, which I got into after recording our first record.

Terry: And last but not least, I’m Terry and I play the bass and I’m a social worker. I don’t think the two have much to do with each other. But, I do think that yoga teachers and therapists are going to be the rock stars of the future.

Melisse: Does anyone in the band have a musical background? Or was anyone in a band before coming to triple creme?

Robin: Christina was.

Christina: Squashed Possum.

Melisse: They were really well known. [Lying]

Christina: We did a song called “Pablo Picasso was Never Called an Asshole.” I played guitar with three boys. I tried to form bands with girls, but we’d hang out and never do anything.

Tiffany: I was in a band before, too.

Christina: Although her’s was actually good.

Terry: I was in several bands. The school band, the church band, the school orchestra, the band in my head…

Robin: Hey, I was in the band in my head, too.

Tiffany: I was in the band in your head.

Robin: Tif plays everything.

Tiffany: You can hardly say that. I started piano, then I took violin, and I’ve had saxophone, jaw harp, guitar, mandolin and drums. What am I missing?

Robin: You play the bucket.

Melisse: How did you all meet?

Christina: We all had sex with the same people. [half-joking]

Melisse: Did you put a gay personal ad saying “one androgenous girl looking for three other androgenous girls to form band”?

Terry: No, really, we all dated the same girl.

Robin: Not me! I just knew Tif. I was straight when I started playing with you guys.

Melisse: So how long have you been together now?

Many voices: Four years.

Robin: It’ll be five years since we played out in January.

Terry: No, we got together in January.

Melisse: triple creme’s a Capricorn! So roughly four years. Where did the name triple creme come from?

Terry: Hell.

Melisse: Do people ask you that a lot?

Robin: No, the question people ask is what kind of music do you play.

Terry: [Answering] The kind that will rock your balls off! What do you say! Chic Rock?

Robin: I usually say, “I don’t know. Why don’t you listen and tell me.”

Melisse: Kat Long interviewed you for Venus (Spring 2002), a women-in-music magazine, and in her article she announced the 10-year anniversary of Queercore bands, and she included you guys in that genre. What do think about that description of triple creme? And what’s queer core?

Tiffany: It kind of died, but I think what Kat was trying to say is that there was a Queercore movement and there’s a renaissance of it. That there’s a lack of it here, but that we hold it up for the East Coast with the Crowns on 45.

Robin: I want to say that we don’t necessarily want to just appeal to the queer scene. I think we’re much more accessible than that. Like we’re not trying to promote ourselves as queer, we’re not trying to write songs that indicate specifically that we’re queer. We just do what we like.

Terry: But it’s not that we’re self hating.

Robin: Right, we don’t pretend that we’re not queer.

Christina: But at the beginning we really played out at queer venues.

Robin: Because we’re in the [queer] scene, but it’s important to branch out.

Christina: And it still is.

Robin: But it’s great, too, that we’re supported by the scene, and we’re totally grateful and thankful for that. But, at the same time, we want to branch out.

Tiffany: The straight boys that brave the queer scene love us.

Robin: Yeah, straight boys love us. Those that aren’t afraid of us.

Melisse: There hasn’t been an all-girl gay band to make it big.

Terry: The Runaways. [Pauses] Don’t print that Joan Jett’s queer. She’ll kick my ass.

Melisse: In American popular music there are soloists, Melissa Etheridge, KD Lang, people on the folk fringe, Ani DiFranco…

Terry: She’s married!

Melisse: She’s married now, but whatever. She’s a queer woman who made it big. Do you think on the other hand that a whole gay band is somehow confrontational, whereas one gay singer is safe, especially if she’s a folksinger?

Terry: Being queer is confrontational, unfortunately. You kind of have no choice; the choice is already made for you…

Robin: … and you’re playing “aggressive” kinds of music.

Terry: Whether or not you’re singing folk songs or playing a violin, just the fact that you’re queer is confrontational.

Christina: Couple that with the kind of music you’re playing…and it becomes, well it’s different.

Robin: It’s more palatable if it’s folk. All the people you mentioned are softer than us, not a guitar kind of thing.

Terry: Well, that’s also if you want to pass. To say it’s not a totally homophobic music world would be--- Well, you don’t see an *NSYNC band being put together of all gay boys, and with the music industry totally into their personalities as being gay. No, the one gay guy in N Sync, you never hear anything about him or his personal life.

Robin: And yet, it’s so funny because I bet a lot of people that run that industry are totally queer.

Melisse: And it’s ironic because on the one hand playing up queer sexuality isn’t something the music industry is working. At the same time, sexuality itself is something that’s always been tied tightly to rock ‘n’ roll and popular music anyway.

Tiffany: Especially if you want to make it as a woman.

Terry: Right, so we’re trying to sell sexxxxx…

Christina: Yeah, by wearing baggy jeans.

Terry: So, our songs aren’t about sex---het sex or even lesbian sex, cause that’s hot stuff, too---so basically, we’re never going to make it. Plus, we’re all chics…

Christina: Well, we could make it, but it’d be underground. It can’t be in the mainstream.

Tiffany: We’d need a label. Although some of our songs on Lucid [forthcoming CD] I could very easily hear on the radio, “Highway,” and “Oceanic.”

Robin: Well, our lyrics are kind of political, so I’m not sure.

Tiffany: But nobody pays attention to lyrics.

Terry: Isn’t that the thing about popular music, dumb the music down?

Christina: Today on the subway this guy had his walkman turned up really high and the song was literally going, “Let’s go get wasted. Then we’ll take our clothes off.”

Robin: I think I’ve heard that song!

Terry: I love that song!

Christina: The whole ride the songs were about drinking and screwing. It was so depressing.

Melisse: So, maybe somehow your lyrics are more political than a lot of stuff that’s out there, and yet you’re not writing songs with a political agenda.

Robin: No, we’re not like Bad Religion or Rage Against the Machine trying to get the message out there.

Christina: Our songs may be political, but also romantic, or funny.

Melisse: You write about a range of topics. So, what do you think about bands like Le Tigre and Bitch and Animal whose lyrics are more overtly political.

Terry: That’s great. That’s what they’re doing. That’s their vehicle.

Melisse: Who are some of the other queer bands in your world that people not in scene would want to know about?

Tiffany: The Butchies.

Melisse: Is there a queer band community here that you play out with?

Tiffany: Slut ‘Em Go!

Christina: Yeah, but the two boys aren’t queer.

Terry: But what is queer music? It doesn’t have to be “Gaywad” [a triple creme song] or music about being queer. There’s no such thing.

Robin: But there’s Homocore [at CBGBs in New York City].

Terry: Well, that’s good times. And Dean Johnson does such a good job of bringing queer bands together.

Robin: When we played a few months ago I saw all these bands I’ve never seen before.

Tiffany: And it was quite diverse. It was really cool. So many queer bands in many genres.

Terry: I feel like I don’t know as many guy queer bands.

Melisse: Oh, you’ve never heard of Depeche Mode?

Terry: Ha! You get in a niche and only hear the chic bands.

Melisse: Youd for Tribe 8 last summer. They are a well-known dyke band. How’d you score that slot?

Terry: [Unprintable jokes about sexual favors not given.]

Tiffany: A promoter came out of the blue and hooked us up. Tribe 8 was incredibly supportive. They always put on a fun show, and it’s just good to see people who’ve been at it that long in the front row of the bands they play with.

Melisse: Are there other bands that inspire you? Who do you listen to?

Tiffany: Lately Fugazi. And Slut ‘Em Go, darediablo, Team Dresch, Blonde Redhead…

Terry: Ozzy!

Tiffany: And we’ve recently found a new love for metal.

Melisse: Where’s the love for metal coming from?

Tiffany: Paul Crook [formerly of Anthrax]…

[Lots of chiming in with crushed out tones of admiration.]

Melisse: How did you meet Paul?

Christina: My cousin, David DiPietro is a guitar guru and he hooked us up with a studio for recording Lucid---the dynamic duo studio of Paul Crook and Scott Metaxas, who used to be in bands such as Anthrax, Prophet, and Nuclear Assault.

Terry: Metal!

Christina: Seeing Paul play the guitar was the most mind-altering musical experience.

Tiffany: He was incredibly giving, and a perfectionist, and he showed you guys how to do stuff.

Terry: Okay, it’s not a love for metal; it’s a love for Paul Crook.

Melisse: You felt a little mentored by these guys then, and would you have ever guessed that these metal guys would play this role for you?

Tiffany: They’re the nicest boys.

Christina: I went in being paranoid, that we were gay, and they’d have a hard time with us.

Robin: But they totally love us. And now that we have this influence the band is totally letting me be more metal now.

Terry: You were Goth before. Not metal. Now, we’re big rock.

Melisse: When we were talking about pop music, you said lyrics generally suck. What’s the band’s approach to writing songs?

Terry: Well, it’s the attitude about lyrics that matters. For us it’s about the meaning of the words, and lots of times [in pop music] it’s about the sound of the words, and they don’t have to actually mean anything.

Melisse: I would say your lyrics definitely have meaning. If I were to look at the lyrics on your website and then I heard what you actually did with those lyrics, putting them to the music you make, with a lot of tempo changes and the way the rhymes sort of fall over two totally different types of measures of music--- Well, how do you make these two things fit together, because it looks like a really hard job.

Terry: What you have to do first is kind of lose your mind [laughs], and then you understand how that all works.

Christina: It’s about not being very linear, I think.

Robin: Well, we aren’t linear but the backbone is. I’ll bring in a rhythm and Tiffany will spend like a half-hour trying to figure out what count it is. And then she’ll say, “Oh, it’s 9/10ths and a half!”

Christina: But we’ll be like, of course. It’s perfectly natural. What’s wrong with you?

Robin: Yeah, we think differently. We’re the poets.

Melisse: So, what are you guys [Terry and Tiffany]?

Tiffany: We’re the backbone.

Terry: WE’RE THE SPINE! You can’t walk without your spine. Where are you going without your spine? Nowhere.

Christina: I’ll slither my ass there if I have to.

Melisse: You were quoted in Venus magazine as saying that your songs are now less about your relationships with specific girls and more about your relationship with the world---

Terry: Well, there’s a whole world of girls out there.

[So much laughing.]

Melisse: So, why did that happen? Was it a sign of your growth or a new direction for the band?

Robin: We all got girlfriends. [Laughs]

Terry: It’s timing and we just got bored of it. Our lives change.

Tiffany: I’m sure we’ll be writing about specific girls at another point.

Terry: Or not. We might be writing about pets…

Robin: I did write about pets!

Christina: We secretly write about god, but nobody knows.

Melisse: What songs are about god?

Christina: “Highway” is about god. And I’m not talking about the Christian God here. More like an absolute truth, not that other kind …

Terry: I don’t write the lyrics, but it’s kind of like what you’re searching for. I think that’s what motivates people to write and create stuff.

Christina: Yeah, it used to be girls, then find the self, now it’s how to identify yourself within the world, and how to work within the structure, and how to create what you feel is necessary.

Melisse: That makes me think about “Magnified,” which is a song that from the outside seems to be about the way fashion builds and also interferes with woman’s identity and sense of her real self. Can you connect that to what you were just talking about?

Robin: Well, if we’re all trying to find our identity by what we wear, who we hang out with, what you say when you’re with people, we’re stuck. Part of the song is about being so nervous that you can’t even talk around people because you’re concerned about outside stuff. It’s all external, like “How am I going to be happy? I’m going to be happy by wearing the right clothes, saying the right things, talking to the right people.” And that is so maddening because we all secretly know that’s not it. It’s totally bullshit, but we all continue to do it.

Christina: “Buy new shoes. Buy new shoes.”

Robin: Right. It [the shoe shopping] makes you magnified. It makes you feel big, but you feel all tiny because inside you’re all like this is not really who I am. This isn’t real. It’s a source of frustration. So the big message is, It’s not out there. It’s inside you. It doesn’t matter what the hell you wear.

Melisse: The end of the song actually suggests that finding it within is the long way through life. Because the woman in the song is still standing there. “She stands there anyway.” The closet door is shut, but she can’t move or is not ready to move.

Christina: She’s naked. She knows this is it. But, she’s like, now what?

Tiffany: It’s like “Different Like Everybody”. These two songs are linked. We choose people like ourselves so we can have an identity.

Melisse: They both share a kind of concern for the way that people are tricked and sucked into the idea that they’re creating a meaningful, personal identity, but they’re still missing something. And they’re still freaked out.

Tiffany: Everybody wants to belong.

Melisse: “4 Boys” is a song where you distinguish between girl-fronted boy bands and girl bands.

Christina: That song is not about god. [Laughs.]

Tiffany: That song is not actually about all bands in general; it’s about one specific band, on a Girl Band Night that we played that was incredibly rude to us.

Terry: They were like, We’re a bunch a guys playing music and we’ll get a crowd by getting a chic to front our band. It happens all the time.

Tiffany: But not on a Girl Night.

Christina: [In a cheesy voice] Not during our celebration of women in music. [Laughs] Seriously, there were no all-girl bands but us there.

Terry: Girls need to start playing. That’s the message. When I was 15, no one wanted a girl bass player in their band.

Tiffany: Or a drummer. It’s the same thing with sports. Boys don’t want you on their team even though you’re twice as good as all them. You have to be three times better and you always have to prove yourself… And even after the Riot Grrrl era, you can only have one female vocalist on the radio in play at a time.

Terry: I think girls get discouraged in music in a way that boys don’t. So fuck that shit. Pick up your guitars!

For more information and mp3s visit www.triplecreme.com.

Wondering what Feminism has done for you lately?Or what you've done for it? In "The Feminism of Everyday Life", Melisse Gelula discusses the practices and perspectives of third wave feminists through many cultural incarnations---from the implicitly personal (why everyone I know is in therapy or writing a book about it?) to the egregiously political (how to get through the Bush presidency?), and from academic topics (my cubicle partner doesn't know who Judith Butler is and she makes more than me, or why did I go to grad school?) to acceptable forms of popular culture (why "Buffy the Vampire Slayer" matters?) and consumerism (why good shoes are essential).

Melisse Gelula is, among other things, an editor at Random House. She is a former rape crisis and domestic violence counselor and is now studying psychoanalysis in New York.

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